Subject: Re: Fw: Your New Goats


Re: Kids dying quickly with green scours



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Re: Kids dying quickly with green scours.

Posted by: "Tim Pierce" timpierce53@yahoo.com   timpierce53

Thu Jun 15, 2006 8:27 am (PST)

KIDS WITH SCOURS LONGER THAN 24 hours is a ICU type situation.

These kids that are falling out with green scours is a Clostridial that is not covered by CD +T . This is a type B clostridial. We have had it and had it necropsied.


Treatment of 25 to 30 lb kid Daily for 5 days. Do not stop just because they are better.
Banamine = 0.5 (tenths)
Baytril = 0.4 (tenths)
Biosol = 5cc Daily.
Lactated ringers to rehydrate them. A six week old kid (30 lbs) needs a whole bag of lactated ringers. Even if the skin test says they are not dehydrated.

Change your vaccinations from CD+T To Covexin 8.
tim

Tim & Debra Pierce
England Creek Ranch
Jacksonville, Texas 75766
The next 3 pages contain the form I use to keep track of each of my goats. The first page is the same for either sex, but the second, or back page, is different. I use a 3 hole punch and put them in a notebook. Mona







From: "Karin Christensen" <livestalk@imagecyte.com>
Subject: Re: How to go in doe??

There are probably lots of web pages but here is what I do.

First I cut down my finger nails as short as possible.  Then I scrub my hands with antibacterial dishwashing soap using a brush on my finger nails.  I do this because I do not use gloves.  I can't feel as well and if they are short they can come off and get lost in the goat.

Then I fill a small bowl with warm, soapy water, carry it in my right hand, which is going to go in the doe out to the barn.  I use my left hand for opening gates and for holding on to the doe's collar.  I dip my right hand in the soapy water and with just two fingers carefully feel a little bit in.  If the cervix feels dilated then I reach in with more fingers and gently be sure that things are open.  If there is a kid close to the birth canal it's easy to feel.  You should be able to feel two feet and a nose if it's positioned correctly.  If that's what I feel, then I stop
and wait a bit.  Sometimes, just doing that will inspire her to push.  It's easier to feel a kid if mom is laying down, but sometimes they won't do that until you've got your whole hand in there.

The one I hate is to feel just a boney large thing and a tail.  This is a breech birth with the back legs forward and the one that seems to cause me the most problem.  Then you need to reach in, find each little hoof, cup it in your hand and bring it out.  You have to be very careful when you do this so you don't puncture the uterus.   Once I have both back feet out, I let mom rest for a minute, then slowly pull with her contractions.

Sideways involves pushing the kid around until you can find the head.  I've had heads pop out with no feet.  You don't want to pull on the head, but I have successfully reached behind the head, found the shoulder blades and pulled from there especially if it's a second or third kid and there is more room.

The hard part is figuring out what you are feeling.  Even though I've done this more often than I like to think about I always get a little panicky.  I stop and say to myself that I can't do this.  Then I tell myself that I have to do this.  What has worked for me is to close my eyes and rest my head on the doe and just concentrate.  It's amazing what you can accomplish.
Karin Christensen
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: "Coni Ross" <crranch@texas.net>
Subject: kids with belly, not growing

First, I would worm them. Be sure to use enough wormer to do the job.
Second, I would calf pac them, and make sure you have a feed with Rumensin. Sometimes kids have sub-clinical coccidiosis, which will interfere with absorption and growth. Coccidiosis will damage the lining
of the gut, and will decrease feed efficiency. If the kids are young, and not getting enough milk, a cup per 50 lbs of feed can be added to the creep feed in the feeder.
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Subject: pot bellied kids

If you  are bottling the kids, hold the bottle up high, so that the milk goes down the esophageal groove, That helps absorption. Second, make sure your milk replacer has Milk as the first ingredient. Measure milk
powder separate from water. If you are feeding kids creep feed, you can add 1 cup of nonfat dry milk (generic will do) from the grocery store. I also use Calf Pac in the feed, and in the milk. Pot belly means the kids
are not getting enough protein. I would put a Rumensin block in with them, unless you have Rumensin in the feed. The Sweetlix Meat Maker Mineral with Rumensin is good too. Coni
 
Coni Ross
CR Ranch
I would give kids an ounce a day, and adults 6-8 oz depending on weight.
Be sure to calf pac, so that they don't scour from it. Coni
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Tim Pierce <Tim@ecrboers.com> wrote:
    Story 1st.
    
    3 or 4 years ago we too lost 20+ kids in a matter of days. All were from 3 weeks to 2 months. After the 3rd kid dropped within 24 hours I took it to the vet. The next day I took 3 more by 5 o clock to the vet.
    
    I spoke with Coni and she suggested 2cc cd antitoxin and 3 cc polyserum every 2 weeks for all of the remaining kids. This did slow the loss rate down but did not stop it. She also said to have the kids posted and find out exactly what was going on.
    
    Test were rushed thru aTm and the result came back as a super mutated form of E-coli. WHAT???  It was only sensitive to lethal doses of Nuflor. No other antibiotic would touch it.
    
        The vet explained that what I had going on was the same thing the dairy cow people dealt with and had learned the hard way. The problem was caused from kidding out over the same ground/area year after year after year. The bacteria gets in the ground, on the walls of the pen, in the barn stalls and kidding jugs and no matter how diligent you are at cleaning you can never get it all. He suggested letting them kid in the pasture or build another barn.
    
    We started treating with Nuflor and It slowed the death rate down. But we still lost 8 to 10 more over the next week.
    
    So I started making plans to build a new barn however that weekend a friend that is a vet in Kentucky was over looking at our herd and I explained all I had learned over the past 2 weeks. He related a similar problem the horse people had in Kentucky. He said if it were him he would get a truck load of Ag Lime and spread it over all of the barn.
    
    OK, now build a new barn or buy a truck load of Ag Lime. $30,000.00 or $500.00. Well I am no rocket scientist but I knew I was loosing in 3 to 4 days what a truck load of Ag Lime would cost so I bought 2 truck loads. I spread it over the entire barn 4 to 6 inches thick. (had to raise all of the gates.) Next morning after the Ag Lime was spread we found 1 dead kid. So maybe this does/does not work. Over the next 3 weeks we kidded out 100+ more kids and had no more losses. So this Ag Lime trick seemed to work.
    
    Now I have since build another barn. Fixin to add on to it. Most importantly I purchased a bunch of old gasoline storage tanks and cut them into 1/4"s Each tank makes 4 shelters 8 feet wide x 4 feet tall x 17 feet long. I use a 12 foot piece of pipe stuck on to my hay fork to move them around. I row up 4 or 5 shelters side by side and at pasture rotation time I move the shelters to the new pasture.  Now I don't have to clean barns anymore with a pitch fork and shovel. I just pick the shelter up and move it to its new location. Run a disc thru where it came from and it is now clean.
    
    Moral to the story.
    Not all problems with kids dying (or does for that matter) is because of disease or bad genetics or poor mothering but are caused by us humans trying to over manage them.
    
    Yes we are having to treat them for the symptoms of something much greater but/and what we as good herdsman have to do is look for the root cause. Too many times our problems are created by ourselves.
    
    Our management practices have to exist simultaneously with good husbandry practices as well as balance with nature. These goats/horses/pigs/llama's etc...  are animals, Not humans and are not to be treated and handled the same way. Even hospitals, modern research and antibiotics can't get rid of staph infections BUT NATURE CAN and does every day in the animal kingdom. Fresh air, sunshine and rain are the greatest disinfectants in nature. The more we work toward leaving them on their natural schedule and in their natural element the better off they are and the less work we have to put into them.

  Other effects of using Ag Lime:
    1. Cleaner barn.
    2. Less flies
    3. Easier clean up.
    4. Better control of bacteria because the Ph level of lime is so great that bacteria CAN NOT grow in it.
    
    Below are some excerpts from previous communiques on this subject for you to read. Take it for what it is.
    ---------------------------------------------------------
      Muddy yards and pens are what prompted me to try this the 1st time. It is the best thing I did. HOWEVER
        Be aware that when you 1st put it around every where that the 1st rain it will be like walking thru jello. Be sure to smooth out all foot prints thru it BEFORE it dries out. Once it dries out it will be almost as hard as concrete.
       We spread ours about 4 to 6 inches deep thru all of the pens, lots, loafing areas and in the barn. I had to raise all of my doors/gates to do this but turned out to be the best thing I ever did around the area. Once it has been rained on and dried out and it hardens you can then sweep it with a broom. Quickly clean up all manure laying around and reduce the fly population in the summer time.
    Good luck and buy in bulk.
    
      Ag Lime - in our parts is like sand. It is the stuff we have to put on our pastures to raise the pH level of the soil. (or nothing grows) Most all of the feed stores around here get it and spread it on folks pastures just like fertilizer. I purchase a 24 yard truck load at a time. It goes a long way. It is brought in from the local rock quarry's. Basically it is ground up limestone. It can be purchased in pellets but for the barn cleansing aspect I prefer to shovel it like sand.
    
    Hydrated Lime - is the powdery stuff you purchase in 50# sacks. Used for white wash, gardening, light duty clean ups around the barn and many other things.

  Tim & Debra Pierce
  England Creek Ranch
  Jacksonville, Texas 75766
  903-541-2851 Home 817-235-0484 Mobil
  website = http://www.ecrboers.com/   E-mail = Tim@ecrboers.com or Debra@ecrboers.com
  Fullbloods, Purebreds, Percentages and Wethers

Date: Wed Apr 26, 2006 4:48am(PDT)
Subject: goats with swelled heads

This sounds like 'big head' caused by Klein grass. It causes hepatic (liver) damage, and swelling of the head and photo sensitivity causing skin lesions. Most commonly Klein grass is most toxic when there are seed heads, and
livestock consume the fresh growing vegetation and seed heads. This can also be caused by some mycotoxins (molds) Cocklebur, Alsike Clover, Blue green algae, aflatoxins, Lantana.

I would give them feed with Calf pac, Dry hay, and pen them until the cause can be determined. It is most likely plant derived. Antibiotic cream to mouth and facial lesions from photo sensitivity can help. Keep them out of
the sun until they are better. In some cases, permanent liver damage occurs.


Coni
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Subject: [The_Boer_Goat] urea

Urea will not hurt goats, but if used as a protein supplement in feed, it is not utilized. As fertilizer it is fine. Cattle can utilize urea to make protein, goats can't. Coni
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I love burgers made with goat meat cooked on a fire. It tastes like sirloin if the goat was fed.

I make stroganoff, carne guisada, tacos, and other moist recipes with goat. My children never knew if they were eating goat or beef unless they saw the bones. Ground goat makes the best taco meat in the world.

My favorite goat to kill is a big show wether, over 100lbs. The round steaks can be treats as per beef round steaks: pounded or tenderized and fried like chicken fried steak, made into peppered steak, or cut in strips, and cooked as per fajitas, then served with tortillas and' Pico de Gallo'.

Fresh salsa:

Use the best tomatoes you can find. In winter, I use Roma or the vine ripe type tomatoes. Cut up about 4 med size tomatoes, 1 large clove garlic, 2 slices of sweet onion, a small handful of fresh Cilantro, 1 hot jalapeno,
the juice half a large lime. Process to the texture you like best, correct the seasoning with salt after you finish. Don't taste it all away: Best with fresh crisp tortilla chips.

I used to make 2 gallons of this so my children would not eat it all before supper. They would eat it anyway, and I make it hot to slow that down. When they were toddlers, they could eat a 2 gallon bowl of this before I could finish making supper.

Coni

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Date: Fri Apr 28, 2006 8:55pm(PDT)
Subject: Re: treating mastitis

I am new to dairy goats. I have never had a mastitis problem with my boers. I bought this lamancha doe last year to supplement my boer babies. No, I did not get a culture done. A dairy goat breeder gave me the advice to switch to excenell.  Thanks so much for all the help.
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Tri-Quest
  To: The_Boer_Goat@yahoogroups.com
  Sent: Friday, April 28, 2006 9:23 PM
  Subject: [The_Boer_Goat] Re: treating mastitis


  REPLY:

  who told you to switch to Excenell ?  Naxcel and Excenel have NO withdrawal time when used in dairy aniamls --that is because the drug does NOT cross the mammary barrier --hence NO GOOD TO TREAT MASTITIS with it ---- i would stick with Pen G -- did you have the milk cultured BEFORE starting treatment?  most folks don't and then when the drug does not work they are out of luck trying to find out what drug will work.

  a good rule to follow --if you are not going to take a culture before you start treatment is to take a sterile sample and freeze it in case you need it if the drug you choose to use does not work

  better yet:  (take sample, start treatment with a wide spectrum Rx and take same to vet --the answer of what drug is BEST should be back in a couple of days---

  If she were mine and nothing seemed to be working i would stop treatment ( ask your vet for how long depending on the drugs you have been using) and draw a sample and find out what drug the BUG is sensitive to.

  YOU WROTE:

  Message 17
       From: "donna" donnamy@nts-online.net
       Date: Fri Apr 28, 2006 5:38pm(PDT)
  Subject: Re: [SPAM] Re: [The_Boer_Goat] help

  Thanks for replying. I have gone through treatment with penicillan.
  Then was told to switch to excenell and TODAY mastitis treatment. Her udder is still hard on that side. Do I treat her again?


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I saw the post stating to double dose all wormers. DON'T DOUBLE DOSE THE LEVIMASOLE womers, Tramisole, etc. They can kill the goat in the normal dose. These wormers are not very effective any more. I have had does start slobbering and having convulsions from a regular dose of this stuff. If you want to use it, have the Atropine on hand, as it is a cholinesterase inhibitor, and atropine is antidotal. Coni

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I would have on had my Atropine if I were using Levamisole products.This wormer is a Cholinesterase inhibitor, it inhibits the parasite, but the margin of safety is VERY close, because it also inhibits the animal.
I have almost killed goats that were wormed with a weight appropriate dose. If you don't have some Atropine on hand, don't give it. On the other hand it can be used to boost the immune system of animals with chronic infection, or illness. It has been used as part of chemotherapy regimes in some cancers that do not respond.
Organophosphate poisoning I use3mg/100 lbs, a very small dose. The goat that is poisoned by Levamisole will slobber, stagger, and have respiratory distress.

Coni Ross
CR Ranch
13285 Ranch Rd. 2325
Blanco, Texas 78606
512-496-3197
www.crranch.org
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Re: [The_Boer_Goat] BoSe
Bill copper and selenium are different
Look at
http://www.saanendoah.com/copper1.html

The losses to local goat breeders were imeasureable, one year in the early '90s a herd in Arizona lost all but three kids to copper deficiency (confirmed by Arizona U and Cornell), they were either stillborn or died within the first few weeks. The loss in mature animals was tremendous to herds experiencing the most severe problems. On the other hand, many of us did not have specific or classic copper deficiency symptoms, but rather a multitude of miscellaneous problems such as frequent staph lesions on the udder, nose, mouth, and chin (occasionally the entire body) and thin/rough/faded hair coats (odd "prickly" coat in the case of some Saanens), maybe nothing more than bald tail tips or light spots on the nose. Other herds had serious problems with increased cases of mastitis including gangrene mastitis (more than a dozen cases of gangrene mastitis in this area in a two year period, when it was virtually unheard of before – and since), ruptured uterus' and pre-pubic tendons (abdominal wall hernia) , hugh hematomas following injections or even a minor injury. What acts like spinal cord injuries in adults (osteoporosis), twisting or bending of the front legs and/or feet in kids and pregnant yearlings (osteoporosis - see photo #1), anemia .... just about anything your can imagine ..... we were all mystified (our veterinarians and professionals in academia included) that our seemingly well managed animals were so plagued; again, some herds experienced NO obvious problems. We now realize that many of these situations were/are a direct effect of a severely compromised immune system resulting from the hypocupric condition.
While other problems (bone disorders - ataxia - hair - cardiovascular) were a direct result of the low levels of copper. Young kids are most often and severely affected, with everything from the classic symptoms of ataxia
(swayback, mild to severe weakness, stumbling, wobbly, completely down in the hindquarters, a stiff shuffling gait - caused by impaired development of the central nervous system, severe ataxia is NOT reversable by treatment with copper) to light colored rings around the eyes, thin hair over the nose and/or around the eyes and/or ears, small size, general weakness or sore joints and general failure to thrive. The does are not able to get kids on the ground with adequate levels of copper to maintain them in good health. Often they are so extremely deficient that they suffer from osteoporosis (soft, porous bones that bend and fracture easily i.e neonatals with rib fractures), severe anemia, or other health problems, some are unable to survive at birth, some appear normal
at birth with symptoms showing soon after or weeks/months later depending on the level of the deficiency and the individual animal.

----- Original Message -----
From: William Barnhill
To: The_Boer_Goat@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2004 6:08 PM
Subject: [The_Boer_Goat] BoSe


IF our area is deficient in copper and DESPITE the fact there is some copper in the goat pellets we use, might it be a good idea to give all of our does a shot of BoSe?

In the ayem, I will be asking the Penn State lab to make sure they do a copper scan on the kids I took them. In the meantime, I wonder if the injection might be a good idea.

Bill

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IM injectionsSq injections

You can give an injection IV accidentally when giving IM or SQ injections, because the goat tends not to stand still. It is even possible to withdraw on the syringe, get nothing, and the goat moves while you are injecting the product, causing an IV injection anyway. It can happen even when great care is taken. That is why sometimes we have 'reactions' to a shot, when it is not really a reaction, but accidentally given IV. Coni

Coni Ross
CR Ranch
13285 Ranch Rd. 2325
Blanco, Texas 78606
512-496-3197
www.crranch.org

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Vaccination sites/needles

I always vaccinate SQ between the forelegs, so that a bump doesn't show much, and is dependent, so that it will drain. Tell me where a goat has enough muscle to give an IM injection that is likely to cause an abscess? I will not use the rear leg, because of the risk of damage to the nerve, and muscle there. I did give my first CL vaccinations there in 1986, and I had goats limp for a month, and some did abscess out even from IM injections, and you talk about a mess to treat in an angora. I use 16 gauge needles for the pneumonia and Cl vaccines. It is faster to get in with a big needle. I have had fewer bumps from vaccinations I think, because I can get it in fast. Think about it: If the injection takes 10 seconds instead to 2-3 seconds, there is more chance of the
goat jumping, and causing the needle to gouge around in there. If bleeding occurs in the vaccination site, then there will be an abscess. I use 20 gauge needles for Covexin 8 in kids, and fullbloods, but for my commercial goats, I use 18s. I need to get it in fast, and efficiently.
Even so, there are very few abscess with the big needles. For Banamine, Oxytocin and Dexamethasone, I use 20 gauge needles. For Penicillin, I usually use 18 gauge. For Nuflor, I use a 16Ga. It is just faster, and more efficient. Coni


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injection sites
Some of the vaccines are irritating to tissue even if there is no contamination of the injection site. A bump on a show goat is a no no. I don't want a goat in the ring with a scar, and someone says " oh look, that goat had a CL." It doesn't matter what really happened, they will think what they want. If the injection causes a bump, and the Covexin-8 is famous for that, then the bump will be there, or look like a CL. If it is between the forelegs, for the most part, it doesn't show. You can lance it, or let it do it's thing by its' self. I usually don't' bother
with it, unless it is obvious. Vaccination abscesses usually drain by themselves. I have had to give penicillin to one goat for an abscess like that in 5 years. She was one who jumped around, so that the needle probably jabbed around and caused some bleeding in there, and provided a culture media for bacteria. I did lance that one, it was the size of a softball. It was full of yellow, liquid. Once lanced, and drained, I sprayed it with Wound Kote, and gave her penicillin. The penicillin was probably unnecessary, since the drained abscesses usually heal promptly
when drained. It is just my policy to give penicillin if I have to cut on something.


To restrain kids, I hold them between my legs, and pull the front end up, then put the head behind my left arm, and vaccinate them between the forelegs. I can't imagine the time it would take to try to throw one. I don't know if I would want to do that to some of the fullblood does, since they are more than double my weight. I usually back the big does up in the chute, butt in a corner, block the front and side with my leg, then bend over and stick them. Even then those wenches are not cooperative. Coni
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CDT vaccines, when to vaccinate


First, there have been many recent vaccine failures with Bar Vac, and Anchor. I switched to Covexin 8, because there has been no break over from it, and it covers 8 Clostridials, including Tetanus. Because of the carrier in the vaccine, there are sometimes bumps at the injection site.
I give a 3cc initial dose, and a 2cc booster 3 weeks later, and there are few bumps with this dose. I called my vet, and he did some research, and we decided on this dose. I have had no break over in the past two
years with this vaccine.
If the does are vaccinated 3-4 weeks prior to kidding, the kids will have colostrum immunity to the diseases until they are 12 weeks old.
The immune system of a goat does not develop enough to have permanent immunity until it is 12 weeks old. You can vaccinate sooner, but you still have to do it at 12 weeks, and 15 weeks, or the kids are not covered. For kids who's dams were not vaccinated, it is best to use CD antitoxin 2cc SQ every 2 weeks to protect them until they are old enough to vaccinate.
Goats can die of Enterotoxemia whether they are fed or not. I have seen kids born on pasture die of enterotoxemia when the does were not fed at all. It is a bacterial infection, and you will loose the fattest,
fastest growing kids (always the best one of course). I have consulted on cases where the producer has never vaccinated, and didn't think it was necessary, and lost 80 kids in 48 hours, and had no idea why. The goats were on pasture with no supplement in spring when pasture quality was good. So do what you want, but I booster the does prior to kidding, then the kids at 12 weeks. Coni

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CAE
JJ
Yes, you are correct. CAE is more dangerous, not treatable, or vaccinatable. At least with CL vaccination can be used to protect negative goats, and to help suppress, and treat CL in positive goats. I have seen it take as many as 4 shots to suppress it in some goats, but eventually you can. If at that point you can not suppress it in a
particular animal, valuable or not I think culling is in order. My opinion is: Look at the value of the goat genetically, and if it is a very good animal, then an attempt at suppression with vaccine is warranted: If it is just an average or below goat, then cull it. NO matter the value, if the animal is a poor doer, and does not respond to
vaccinating, then it's immune system is not good, and it needs to go. The vaccines are killed, and can not transmit disease to the goat. An abscess at the injection site is not evidence of Cl, but an injection abscess. If you give the vaccination between the forelegs, it is not as visible if a bump forms. Bovi Sera has antibodies to Corynebacterium Pyogenes (CL) and can be given SQ to kids if does are not vaccinated to help protect them until they are old enough to vaccinate. Coni
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Re: [The_Boer_Goat] Pizzle rot/mucopurulent vaginitis
The 2 Boer bucks that I've had with pizzle rot had "sloppy" sheaths, as opposed to a tight and tidy sheath. Does anyone else have an opinion as to whether this contributes to pizzle rot?
Terry


Subject: [The_Boer_Goat] Pizzle rot/mucopurulent vaginitis


In bucks it is pizzle rot, in does it is called mucopurulent vaginitis. It is a bacterial infection, and in does causes a very swollen infected looking vulva, with pus sometimes dripping out. Bucks have a similar type infection
of the penis, which causes scar tissue very quickly. It can be transmitted to the buck by one doe, thus transmitted to the rest of the does bred by that buck. The infection can be caused by anything from Corynebacterium species bacteria, Usually Corynebacterium Renale, Mycoplasma, and others.
Bucks can also get this infection from riding one another, and the buck does not have to have this illness more than a couple of weeks to have a scabbed scarred looking prepuce. The infection is so aggressive, I have seen it look like your description in only 7-10 days from onset.

High protein intake can influence the onset in a buck, because of increased urea, but bacteria must be present to cause the problem. I have seen Angoras have this because of wet urine soaked hair around the penis.

I would have the vet do culture and sensitivity to determine what will be most effective in the treatment. Meanwhile, I would clean the pizzle with Novalsan solution, scrub well, to assess any scar tissue. Meanwhile, I would give at least 15cc SQ of Penicillin, and !0cc Bovi Sera (has the antibodies to Corynebacterium) and then a Cephalosporin mastitis infusion into the penis and sheath. Lay the buck on his back or side, and massage the med up into the sheath as far as possible. Hopefully the vet will get the culture and sensitivity back quickly to be sure treatment is correct. If the does have it, treat them the same way. Be sure to culture before using the buck again.

I have seen this cured with plain penicillin, and Mastitis infusion. If it won't hurt an udder, it won't hurt the penis.

BE SURE TO CULTURE! Coni

Coni Ross
CR Ranch
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On Mon, 19 Dec 2005 21:15:45 -0600 "Circle I Ranch" wrote:

Hello all,
We have a doe kid with swollen knees, they are crusty and "smell sick".
She tends to walk stiff legged and when she stands won't put one down at all. She's being bottle fed and it appears that another bottle baby is starting to develop the same symptoms.


We applied a spray on antibiotic and wrapped it up. She seemed to walk better with the wrapping applied.

Any one have an idea as to what it might be and how we might stop it?

Thank you in advance,

Doug and Vicky Inich
Circle I Ranch
American Ingenuity Breeding American Genetics
----------------------------------------------------

Doug and Vicky,

You might consider treating them for Mycoplasma bacteria by giving them Biomycin (or LA 200) injections according to weight.


Mycoplasma bacteria can cause a lot of things.....swollen knees, pink eye, pneumonia, and abortion to name a few. This is probably one of the most under-diagnosed causes of illness in goats because it mimics so many other diseases. If the Biomycin clears it up then you may want to consider vaccinating them with Myco-Bac B vaccine. I'm sure there are tests for it, but I'm not sure if they are easily or quickly run.

This particular bacteria caused pneumonia in about ten doelings and swollen knees in three little bucks I had. There were so many to treat that it ended up being more economical to sell them at auction and cut my losses. I now vaccinate for it so I don't have a repeat of that fiasco.

Mona Enderli
Enderli Farms
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Re: anybody heard of mycoplasma? - Ray

Thank you for the information. I don't think I have it in my herd yet, but it's in a lot of the feedlots around here and after talking with the local lab, there are 13 strains that cattle can get. Some of those will cross species and many of them are natrually occurring flora of the nasal passages of many species. Makes it hard to deal with. And the darn stuff doesn't have a cell wall, so all the antibiotics designed to work on a cell wall to destroy bacteria dont' work very well. So now, it my disease causing organism list I have, virus, bacteria, fungus, prion and mycoplasma. Wonder what I'll have to add next week?

Thanks again.

Sherry

--- In The_Boer_Goat@yahoogroups.com, "Ray/Jannette Wood"
rwood@w...> wrote:
This is what Coni Ross posted in September of last year on this...


The Mycoplasma that cattle get is not the same that goats get. I talked to Texas Vet labs last year, and they have been trying to develop a vaccine for goats that covers Mycoplasma. They could not even give Mycoplasma to goats from the cattle type. So NO, the cattle vaccine will
not work. The hog vaccine might. If you loose one of the goats, please have your vet send an entire lung to Texas Vet labs. They want to develop a vaccine, and need the variant that goats get in order to do this. Wouldn't it be nice to have a pneumonia vaccine that covers Mycoplasma too? I will get their phone number and to you tomorrow. I will call them myself to pave the way for you. Since Pasturella was cultured with the pneumonia you have. I would give Polyserum, Nuflor, and continue with the Naxcel. Mycoplasma is very
hard to cure. If you do not have good resulte, I would use Septra, or Sulfadimethox at the same time as you give the Nuflor each day. Coni

Coni Ross
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Easy humane euthanasia

I have used this on a much loved horse. Get a plastic bag or cloth bag, like an old pillow case, and cut out a corner. Take duct tape, and a 10' length of water hose ( this is enough to keep it cool)or swimming pool
vacuum hose, connect to the corner of the bag, and then to the tail pipe of a truck, or car. Start the engine, and cover just the animal's nose with the bag. Carbon monoxide kills very quietly. The animal does not panic since it can see, and breathe. Carbon monoxide is similar to oxygen, so it does not cause panic, fear, or distress, it just kills fast, quietly, and gently. I hate it, but at times it needs doing, and if you can't use a fast humane bullet, then this is a reasonable alternative. Coni

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