Note: See also the files: Germany-msg, mercenaries-msg, SwissGuard-msg, p-armor-msg, fd-Germany-msg, cl-Germany-msg, mercenaries-msg



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Landsknechts-msg - 4/10/05
German mercenaries and soldiers of the 16th century Holy Roman Empire.
NOTE: See also the files: Germany-msg, mercenaries-msg, SwissGuard-msg, p-armor-msg, armor-msg, fd-Germany-msg, cl-Germany-msg, mercenaries-msg.
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NOTICE -
This file is a collection of various messages having a common theme that I have collected from my reading of the various computer networks. Some messages date back to 1989, some may be as recent as yesterday.


This file is part of a collection of files called Stefan's Florilegium. These files are available on the Internet at: http://www.florilegium.org
I have done a limited amount of editing. Messages having to do with separate topics were sometimes split into different files and sometimes extraneous information was removed. For instance, the message IDs were removed to save space and remove clutter.
The comments made in these messages are not necessarily my viewpoints. I make no claims as to the accuracy of the information given by the individual authors.
Please respect the time and efforts of those who have written these messages. The copyright status of these messages is unclear at this time. If information is published from these messages, please give credit to the originator(s).
Thank you,

Mark S. Harris AKA: THLord Stefan li Rous

Stefan at florilegium.org

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From: jheinen at mcl.ucsb.edu (Jeff Heinen)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Landsknechts

Date: 25 Sep 1996 00:58:22 GMT

Organization: University of California, Santa Barbara
It seems much of the disagreement over how heavily armored landsknecht

soldiers were stems from confusion over terminology. While it is true

that period sources refer to landsknechts as being "lightly armored" or

wearing a "half armor," it must be recognized that these terms of

description are relative to what was considered "full" armor of the

period. To be fully armored in this period was to be encased in steel

from head to toe, every inch of one's body protected. The landsknecht, on

the other hand, usually wore a "sallet, gorget, breast and back (usually

furnished with short laminated tassets), and a 'pair of splints' (arm

harness)." (Edge & Paddock, Arms & Armor of the Medieval Knight. p. 140)

In other words, the landsknecht wore what the typical SCA fighter who

fights in plate wears, minus knee protection. Edge states that this is

what the landsknechts "habitually" wore. (140) I've personally never seen

anyone take the field in the SCA who was wearing anything that even

approached a 16th century full armor.
So the argument that landsknechts were "unarmored" simply falls apart and

hence the rationale for wearing plastic to simulate the "unarmored"

landsknecht no longer works either. If you want to be a landsknecht, you

should actually be wearing as much armor as your typical heavy.


Now celts, on the other hand, did fight with no armor. In fact, they

often fought naked. That would be something to see...


-Gottfried

+--------------------------------+----------------------------------+

| Jeff Heinen | "Neccessitas non habet legem." |

| jheinen at mcl.ucsb.edu | -St. Augustine |

| http://www.calpoly.edu/~jheinen| |

|================================+==================================|

| Department of History | Senior Consultant |

| University of California | Microcomputer Lab |

| Santa Barbara | UCSB |

+--------------------------------+----------------------------------+

From: Mike Foster

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Landsknechts

Date: Wed, 25 Sep 1996 05:38:03 -0700


Jeff Heinen wrote:

> It seems much of the disagreement over how heavily armored landsknecht

> soldiers were stems from confusion over terminology.
No.
>The landsknecht, on

> the other hand, usually wore a "sallet, gorget, breast and back (usually

> furnished with short laminated tassets), and a 'pair of splints' (arm

> harness)." (Edge & Paddock, Arms & Armor of the Medieval Knight. p. 140)


Thank you for the reference, I will certainly look into it.

"It was uncommon for the normal footsoldier to wear armor.... never wore

a backplate... due to lack of resources..." (Douglas Miller & G.A.

Embleton, Osprey Men-at-Arms Seris, The Landsknechts, pg. 35)

This was the only passage I could find on armor at all (well, I am late

for work). There is a portion of the book set aside for weapons,

artillery, organization, campaigns... everything except armor. Most

likely because there wasn't much to say. When describing the muster, it

mentions that prospective landsknechts were expected to bring their own

equipment, "which depended on whether the recruit brought his own

weapons or not" (pg.4), which again specifically leaves out any mention

of armor. Landsknecht soldiers were not knights, they were "a motley

crew of journeymen, peasants, and students" (pg.4). Of all the

depictions in the book, only 2 of the people in armor are *not*

officers. One wears a breastplate and nothing else, the other a

breastplate and short tassets. Anything nearing what you describe was

only worn by high-ranking officers.
> So the argument that landsknechts were "unarmored" simply falls apart and

> hence the rationale for wearing plastic to simulate the "unarmored"

> landsknecht no longer works either.
I trust my reference material more than yours, therefore my rational

stands.
>If you want to be a landsknecht, you

> should actually be wearing as much armor as your typical heavy.
I disagree, unless you want to be Frundsberg :-)

From: jheinen at mcl.ucsb.edu (Jeff Heinen)

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: Landsknechts

Date: 26 Sep 1996 02:46:17 GMT

Organization: University of California, Santa Barbara


Mike Foster wrote:

> I trust my reference material more than yours, therefore my rational

> stands.
We'll just have to agree to disagree. I definately give more credence to

Edge and Paddock than to the Man-at-Arms series. I've never found a

Man-at-Arms book in a research library, while I have run into Edge and

Paddock's book a few times. They've also been referenced in scholarly

journals, something I can't say of the Osprey books.
-Gottfried

+--------------------------------+----------------------------------+

| Jeff Heinen | "Neccessitas non habet legem." |

| jheinen at mcl.ucsb.edu | -St. Augustine |

| http://www.calpoly.edu/~jheinen| |

|================================+==================================|

| Department of History | Senior Consultant |

| University of California | Microcomputer Lab |

| Santa Barbara | UCSB |

+--------------------------------+----------------------------------+

From: tomhelmers at aol.com

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: LandsKnecht-HELP

Date: 21 Jan 1997 06:05:06 GMT


Maeryk Gutentag!
Welcome camraden!
The easiest/cheapest/comprehensive book is Osprey's MAn at Arms series #58

on the Landsknechte's & can be found for about $12 easily. Try many of the

online or mail order bookstores.
Two long out of print & hard to find but excelent books on the topic are;
1) The Art of War in the 16th Century by Sir Charles Oman

-This covers the intire century very detailed.


2)The Triumph of Maximilian I, reprint by Dover books with plates by

Hans Burgkmair & Albrecht Durer

-Over 130 detailed woodblocks of Landskenchtes & civilians. It was done in

about 1519 & is EXCELENT source for garb ideas from hats to shoes.


Also look up any of the books on the Sack of Rome in 1527. There are

several out there. Good Luck!


Good words to do searches on are; Landsknecht, Frundsberg, & Mercenary.
These pretty well cover it. If you, or anyone else, needs help on

Landsknechte info feel free to email me.


My persona is that of a Landsknechte fighting the Italian Wars under

Frundsberg. I fight as a Landsknechte & look forward to seeing more of us

out there.
Chous

Lord Amalric von Regensburg

From: tomhelmers at aol.com

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Re: LandsKnecht-HELP

Date: 30 Jan 1997 04:17:28 GMT


Hello Again
I forgot a new & REALLY good reference. Opsrey's campaign series just came

out with a book on the battle of Pavia 1525. The book is #44 in the series

& is an excellent book on this very important Landsknechte battle. As with

most Osprey books should be easily found & sells in the $15 range.


& I stand corrected on guten Tag (2 words) Sorry.
Chous

Amalric von Regensburg

From: Julie Adams

Newsgroups: rec.org.sca

Subject: Landsknecht Living History Website

Date: Mon, 11 Aug 1997 22:37:20 -0700


The Kriegshunde Fahnlein is proud to announce its new web site:

http://www.st-mike.org/groups/german/homepage.html


The Kreigshunde is a living history re-enactment type group which

focuses on the culture of the Landsknecht, 16th century soldiers of the

Holy Roman Empire. It is heavily under construction, but there are lots

of photos of the group -- lots of landsknecht and women's costumes, some

women's costume guidelines (will be updated with images soon),

Renaissance German names, occupations, games and songs, and a huge page

of great medieval and renaissance links. We plan to grow a lot over

time, so keep checking back.


The email address on the site may not be up yet, so please send any

comments or questions to me: savaskan at sd.znet.com, or the Group Manager

at: mr.matt at worldnet.att.net
Julie Adams

Web site Administrator

aka Juliana Hirsch

(OL - SCA)

Subject: ANST - Landsknecht Drawings

Date: Sun, 09 Aug 98 10:11:43 MST

From: Erik Langhans

To: '!Ansteorra Net'"


A couple of people have asked that I post some pictures of Landsknecht for

SCA costuming/armour purposes. I have over 30 from period woodcuts and

pen/ink drawings. You can find these on my web site at

www.cityscope.net/~modius


Go to the Landsknecht Quarters at the Castle.
Modius

Ansteorra

Landsknecht

Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 19:13:03 +0100 (MET)

From: "Kai D. Kalix"

Subject: Re: [sca-cooks] time of year/what to serve?

To: sca-cooks at ansteorra.org
Selene wrote:

> The word "Landsknecht" literally means "land farmhand" so fresh fresh

> early summer foods would be in order. Making a big deal of the World

> Premiere of the first summer berries, calloo callay! A rainbow of stone

> fruits should just be appearing by June.

>

> The "Landsknecht" clothing style is known for combining many colors, the



> more the better, so work that visual theme into the menu as well.

> Many-colored dishes of sauces, etc.


"Landsknecht", more literally "knave of the land/country" were a kind of

levy military, especially (IIRC) in the 30-year-war. And yes, their clothing

was colorful, as to hurt your eyes.
Landsknechte were often drawn in taverns, getting some poor drunk bloke to

sign (xxx, if analphabet) up to some army fighting in some war the new



Landsknecht probably didn't even know anything about.
kai

Directory: files -> CULTURES
CULTURES -> Note: See also the files: n-drink-ves-msg, n-drink-trad-art, Norse-food-art, n-calenders-art, Norse-games-art, books-Norse-msg, Norse-women-bib, Vikg-n-Irelnd-art, n-furniture-lnks
CULTURES -> Wales-lnks – 10/26/03
CULTURES -> Note: See also the files: cl-Byzantine-msg, Byzant-Cerem-art, me-feasts-msg, me-dance-msg, commerce-msg, Balkans-msg, Turkey-msg, fd-Byzantine-msg
CULTURES -> Mongols Nomads or Barbarians
CULTURES -> Gypsy-tmeline-art- 3/1/03 "Timeline of the Roma" by Sayidda Rakli Zada Orlenda
CULTURES -> Note: See also the files: Jews-msg, Byzantine-msg, Byzant-Cerem-art, Palestine-msg, crusades-msg, The-Crusades-lnks, Islam-msg, pilgrimages-msg
CULTURES -> Note: See also the files: mercenaries-msg, Italy-msg, popes-msg, rosaries-msg, relics-msg, saints-msg


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